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PostPosted: January 26, 2018, 7:19 am 
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Week 20

Well I'm back in the '62 after a week of bad weather, the streets are finally clear and the snow is gone, the '62 is unstuck, back on the road. I hate to keep saying it but the '62 is just such a pleasure to drive that when I have to get in something else I miss it a lot.... I did a lot of things wrong building it since it was my first time that I won't repeat on the '65 or the upcoming '62 step side truck, for me it's a learn as you go process doing the chassis swaps and with each one I do they get better and better. (at least it seems that way from my perspective..lol)

The mistakes I made are small in the grand scheme of the build, mostly not doing the pre-assembly mock up that you saw me do on the '65 build, in a lot of ways that mock up makes a lot of difference when putting things together for the last time. Yeah the mock up took several days or weeks out of the build schedule but well worth the effort in my opinion, if you watch any of the "car shows" on TV where they build custom cars the steps they follow are very similar to how I've been building the '65 and pre-assembly mock up is one of those areas that I had to learn the hard way that it is important.

In contrast when we built the '62 uni I did do some mock up but in the end I had the front end sheet metal on and off the truck over 6 different times instead of twice in the '65 build, of course I had a lot better idea with the '65 of the direction, plan, and work that needed to be done and the order in which it needed to be completed so even doing the necessary mock up it took less time to get it right.

But all in all the mistakes are really only noticeable to my wife and I, we all learn from our mistakes and change tactics to fit the situation and avoid making the same mistake twice, when you have no idea or direction it's easy to lose your path or direction and have to backtrack....but we do learn making course adjustments as we go. I'm very happy with the '62 uni and by being critical of our work it makes the next build even better...

I've always been a goal oriented type of person, this type of build (chassis swap) is just the type of work I like to do because you can see progress with everyday you put into the project, most goals are easily achievable, the work is relatively easy, and really the cost isn't so much if you re-purpose a lot of items from your donor and don't care about slick paint but like anything else you can spend whatever amount of money you want and build to whatever level your heart desires.

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Speaking of the other two trucks the '65 is humming right along in the final assembly phase of the build it should run and move under its own power by the end of the week which will mark the final crest of the hill on the build, there is still lots to do but it'll be all downhill from that point.

Some of you might have noticed the new thread for the '62 step side and the donor we bought for that build, I don't expect to see much movement on that project till spring or early summer but wanted to get its own thread going so we can add updates between now and when the project gets into full swing.

The '62 step side is going on a '09 CV P71 chassis which while basically the same panther chassis as the '98 we used for the uni it has a few notable differences like rack & pinion steering, Trac-Loc rear differential, 17" wheels, bigger brake rotors and calipers, throttle by wire, and power pedals (the brake and throttle pedals are adjustable ). There are other differences, the 4.6L is rated at 260HP and supposedly has a improved fuel delivery system and throttle body over the '98 4.6L engine which was rated at 216 hp. The rear end is supposedly still a Watts Link but has been improved and the rear shocks moved outboard to the end of the axle housing instead of the inboard arrangement the '98 has.

It should make for a fantastic platform to build off of.... we'll see.... lol

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Have a great weekend

Jon


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PostPosted: February 2, 2018, 7:27 am 
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Week 21

Nothing new to report the '62 is humming right along every day, we are at a little over 5 months of daily driving and quickly approaching that 6 month mark which to me will be a "proof of concept" moment, 6 months of driving with no problems pretty well tells me that the project was a success, the transplant patient survived and should have a long and fruitful life...lol

But it's also around that 6 month mark that I do want to pull the '62 off the street and take a long hard look at everything I did, checking the body mounts, my welds, my wiring, basically look for potential problems. I don't think there will be any issues and if that is the case then I want to spend the time to finish the few projects left to complete the build. I do have a couple new rattles that may just be because of all the cold weather, they seem to come and go with how cold it is outside and the depth of the "chuck hole" I'm forced to hit because of on coming traffic, and of course I still only have about half of the front sheet metal bolts in the truck so I'm sure that is moving around some also, but nothing has fallen off yet...lol

All of this is dependent on when the '65 is street able, we are not that far away, but still have lots to do to get the '65 road-worthy. It might be when the '62 is at 7 months instead of 6 but as I've said before when I can start driving the '65 for its shake-down the '62 will come in for its look-see and finishing.

I know the wife won't let me stay in her truck very long, a week or two at the most which should be enough time to make sure once she starts driving it I won't get a call telling me she is stranded, I doubt that would happen but given the level of change we have done to the Roadmaster giving it the slicks body and changes to the wiring really anything is possible, not likely, but possible none the less, better it happens to me than to her in my opinion..

The '65 is already licensed and insured so in that regard its ready, we of course will have to build another raised bed floor and I'm making a materials list for that now, but that won't keep it off the road, the fuel tank is secure and the old filler fits between it and the tailgate so adding fuel is about as easy as it could get.

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Some of you folks may remember a post from weeks ago where I was talking about a "body shop" guy who was looking at the '62 here at work and left abruptly after looking under the hood, he was back yesterday and payed me a complement saying he wished he had something like the '62 to drive instead of the $60k+ diesel pick up he was driving, I think after thinking about the '62 after his first look at it he "got it" and now understands why we built it, he asked a lot more questions about the swap this time kinda' like he was thinking about doing one his self...lol

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Have a great weekend.

Jon


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PostPosted: February 9, 2018, 7:14 am 
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Week 22

Note: Sometimes I type my posts out in MS word ahead of posting them (like this one and my post Wednesday morning), I find it easier to read through the post over the course of a day or so, add and remove content to the post, add links, then just cut and paste the text into the Slck60's reply/post box. It's also why sometimes I have longer posts because I've worked on that post off and on for a day or so, it's just way easier to get the content posted since I'm not doing it on the fly then having to go back and edit the post several times, doing this also helps with my syntax and spelling, It also gives me the chance to look at the pictures I've taken and match the topic/text to the picture, sometimes I see a picture that I forgot about and can add that with the appropriate text explaining what we did.

I take a lot more pictures than I post most of the time because we keep a build folder for each truck mostly for reference or if we ever did decide to sell one of them, I wouldn't want to sell one of the trucks to someone without them looking at the build photos so they can see what has been done, of course I can also point a potential buyer to this forum for the blow by blow account....lol

I also wanted to say that probably after the 6 or 7 month look see at the '62 I'll probably stop posting in this thread unless something happens to the '62 that warrants a additional post to the thread, I don't want the thread to turn into basically a blog for our builds, that was never the intention of the thread and there are other places on the forum for that type of info to be posted. The other two threads can stand on their own and who knows there could always be yet another build after the '62 step side truck, I'm more than willing to just keep building trucks but I have a feeling after the step side build the next project on the horizon would be a Chevy build for my father-in-law that I won't be able to post on the Slick60's forum.

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I'm writing this on Wed, we have ice, sleet, and snow forecast again so the '62 is back in the shop protected from the elements and idiots, hopefully this is just a one day thing....we'll see.

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Thursday now and of course the weather was a no show going northeast of us so I'm back in the '62 after driving the '95 GMC 4x4 yesterday which I'm beginning to really not like doing...lol

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We have the glass guy coming on Saturday to install a new windshield and the old back glass in the '65, we have new gaskets for both so hopefully that will go ok, it's funny when we were calling around local glass shops to get pricing on the windshield and installation, several companies wouldn't do the truck, they said they had no one who knew about doing windshields with a rubber gasket...lol

Then one of the companies said they wouldn't do it if it was a "show truck" or if it had chrome insert in the rubber gasket, one guy said he was the only one at that shop that had ever done one with a rubber gasket....he was willing but a little high on the price in my opinion.

I really want to see how the windshield is installed, I don't think it's that difficult but until I watch the guy I'll never know if it's something we could just do ourselves in the future. Before we sold the '91 GMC truck we had Safelite install a new windshield in it, we asked that guy about doing the '65 and he said that they would but had to send out a supervisor and at least one other guy to get it done, and that it would be expensive...lol

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Once the doors are back on the '65 we can get the '62 step side cab and bed in the shop on dollys so they can dry out and be evaluated, at that point we will have the shop space to keep them inside since if need be the '65 can be ran outside in any weather. That's the goal this weekend is to get the glass installed and the interior/exterior side of the doors painted, then we can rebuild the window channels, modify the regulators for the power window motors and get them re-hung on the cab.

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Hopefully next week we should have the seat cover for the Roadmaster seats which we will be putting in the '62 and taking the bench seat out of the '62 and putting it in the '65, we are also going to take the factory mirrors off the '62, plug the holes in the doors with the rubber plugs, and install mirrors that mount to the door edge or lip, I do use the rearview mirrors but more often than not I use the backup camera when backing up, it's a really nice feature that I'm glad we incorporated into the build.

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Here's a little video to get you through your weekend....



Have a great weekend!

Jon


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PostPosted: February 9, 2018, 10:05 am 
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Jon, when I bought my '64 the previous owner had purchased a new windshield gasket from Dennis Carpenter but had never installed it. The original gasket in the truck was in bad condition, hardened and it leaked. I had a close friend come over and help me and my father-in-law replace the gasket. It did take a couple of hours to do it. Mine has the chrome strip in the gasket. The trick is to lay the windshield on sawhorses (with blankets underneath) and install the new gasket to the windshield. The chrome strip goes into a 'pinch weld' that helps to hold the gasket to the windshield. You then set the bottom of the windshield over as much of the truck's pinch weld as possible and using the 'cord method' you have someone inside the truck pulling the cord/rope over the pinch weld which subsequently pulls the gasket lip in. If you take your time and it is good to have three involved in the installation, it can be done. Also make sure that the windshield is centered (as much as possible) in the opening. We also used a spray bottle of silicone to lubricate the gasket to help it slide into place. My father-in-law and I did the back window later on....same idea, same method. The back window was a little harder for some reason. I had to take a plastic tool (small spatula looking instrument the glass shop gave me) and work the gasket over the pinch weld. You install the rear window from the inside and the windshield from the outside.

But if you have the $$$ to pay someone...I would pay them to do it.

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PostPosted: February 9, 2018, 10:23 am 
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SteveCanup wrote:
But if you have the $$$ to pay someone...I would pay them to do it.


Thanks for the info Steve, that helps a lot, I have the basic idea of how it is done but didn't realize the rear window goes in from the inside....lol

In this case we weighed out buying the windshield and installing it ourselves vs the quotes we got from glass places here in town, in the end it came down to a liability issue, if we bought our own windshield and broke it trying to install it we of course would have to buy another and either try it again or just get a glass company to do it. We have a independent guy (has his own side business doing glass) that we have used for years here at work, he even put the windshield back in our Camaro after it was painted. Long story short he said he would supply the windshield and install it for $225 as long as we had the new gasket..... I didn't think it was worth the risk of the wife and I trying to do it for that kind of money. I did kind of spring the rear window on him after he quoted the front we'll see how much extra that costs.

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PostPosted: February 9, 2018, 2:06 pm 
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I guess I should also mention that we set a budget on the '65 build similar to the '62 uni of between $5-6k (no more than $6k), we have on both builds used money that was gotten from the sale of other vehicles instead of using income or savings, although we have tapped our reserve stash to buy donors and then replaced that money by selling other vehicles. What we are basically doing is "trading down" from newer vehicles to slicks we are building, on the '62 uni we are slightly over $5k into that build and on the '65 are approaching $4k, some stuff is paid out of pocket from weekly income like the starter for the RM or the tune up parts, but by and large the bulk of the builds are financed by the sale of other vehicles we were driving or owned.

If you look at the used car market and look at what you can buy for $5-10K it's mostly high mileage cars or junk trucks that are well past their life expectancy, use to be you could buy a really nice vehicle for around $3k that had a lot of life left in it and a nice project vehicle for $500, those days are gone, $3k will get you a project (money pit) and $8-10k will get you a daily driver that has life left in it. (thank you cash for clunkers). We had a guy just a few weeks ago come into the shop with a '08 Dodge Ram 1500 4x4 with 90k on the clock (5.7L Hemi) that he paid over $18k for.... think about that for a minuet, this wasn't a 5.9L Cummins, this wasn't a 2500 or 3500 series truck, this was a regular quad cab (not a mega cab) 1500 4x4 pickup with 90k on the clock for over $18k and he of course financed the truck which will drive his investment to about $21k or $22k depending on his credit rating and the length of the loan. Yeah it has a Hemi into it.....woop-t-do! (I'm not impressed with the marketing yank). I had another guy not so long ago that paid $24k for a 5 year old Chevy pickup and was bragging about how great a deal it was....really? Yesterday I had a guy in the shop that has been looking at new trucks for the last few weeks and said that a brand new half ton truck (pick your own manufacturer) is starting at around $35k and to get something loaded is basically over $45k, and of course you can spend a lot more like $70k for a new Ford Platinum edition or $84k for a Ford Diesel Dually..... think about that for another minuet, I have no desire to pay more for a vehicle than I paid for my house.

Another case in point is this week on Craigs List was a '66 Ford F100 ran and drove (limited), needed sheet metal work and the guy had all the new sheet metal, he was asking $4400 for the truck, $4400 dollars...... who in there right mind would pay that kind of money for a project? another ad had a '63 uni that had bondo in all the right places to hide the rot and it had to be trailer-ed home because no brakes....and this guy wants $2400 because it's a rare unibody truck. I could go on and on but I think you folks get the jest of what I'm on about.

My point in telling you folks this is that while we are trading down so to speak we are getting custom built trucks for what some folks would consider pocket change ( I don't, but some would), instead of paying a high insurance and licensing we are paying the minimum on 50+ year old vehicles that are/will be driven daily. I have a pretty jaded view point of new vehicles from working on them for all the years I have and I've voiced my opinion before about how it's a very poor investment (in my opinion) or way to spend your income buying a depreciating asset like a vehicle. Granted people have to buy new vehicles I get that, it's just not the way I choose to roll...lol

(Disclaimer: I'm only stating my opinion, I mean no ill intent or disrespect to anyone by my comments above, I do understand everyone has different wants, needs, and desires, and everyone places a different value on things based on those wants and needs, people are free to ask whatever they think the market will pay for whatever they are selling and we all have the option to walk away.)

Jon


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PostPosted: February 9, 2018, 2:43 pm 
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I agree with you, added to the fact that most people are looking to get rid of a vehicle because it is starting to have problems. the reality is most folks want more for their problem vehicles than blue book. My son was just looking at a high milage 89 toyota 4x4 extended cab that the seller wanted 2k over blue book.....NOT

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PostPosted: February 9, 2018, 3:05 pm 
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Ditto on the opinion about new vehicles. I've told all 3 of my grown children to never buy a new car....let them depreciate at few years then buy. Like you I would rather drive my '64 F-100 than my 2015 vehicle...and it's more fun...

$225 for windshield and install? That is a bargain! Mine was shattered about a year after I replaced the gasket....local glass shop put a new one in for $160. I got a deal only because when the windshield was delivered to his shop that morning, it had a very minor "buff" on the outside of the glass in the top driver's side. The guy was going to sent it back...asked me if I could live with it (it was barely noticeable) so he discounted the windshield to $90 and installed for $70. You would never see the 'buffed' place in the glass...

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PostPosted: February 9, 2018, 3:25 pm 
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SteveCanup wrote:
$225 for windshield and install? That is a bargain!


Yes Sir, that's why I'm not messin' with it, if he breaks it he'll have to order another on his dime, I suspect he is getting the glass for around $100-$130, doesn't really matter if it was $85, for $225 he has the job and I really don't care if he scratches the paint...lol

Then again I know he is going to "dink" me on the rear window, he wanted to know if it was tempered or laminated safety glass which I had no idea, he said most of the rear windows in the older trucks were tempered glass which I guess you have to be more cautious installing... but even if he charges me another $50 to put the back glass in I'll be happy.

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PostPosted: February 9, 2018, 7:20 pm 
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I helped the dude instal my windshield and my rear glass about a year ago. I wouldn’t be able to do the windshield by myself cause it has the stainless steel trim. The rear glas was super easy with a rope and soap. Wrapped the roap around the inside of the seal, and pit the glass in from the inside of the truck, pulling the rope from the outside. Done in 10 minutes tops on that back glass.

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PostPosted: February 10, 2018, 1:33 pm 
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I've done quite a few of the rubber gasket type windshields and back glass. I used 1/8 inch nylon rope and dish soap. Soak the rope in dish soap, so it's dripping wet. Put the gasket onto the glass and then put the rope into the groove that fits over the pinchweld. Put some soap into a squeeze bottle (ketchup/mustard bottle) and use that to put soap into the groove in the rubber gasket if addl is needed. then pull the rope and work the rubber over the pinchweld. It's very messy and very slippery, but the gasket slides over the pinchweld a lot easier. It is definitely a two person job.

I couldn't agree more on buying new vs older vehicles. Unfortunately up here in the rust belt, it's kind of hard to find nice clean older vehicles. Makes for a good excuse to take a road trip !!

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PostPosted: February 23, 2018, 9:57 am 
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Week 23

Everything is still fine with the '62 nothing really new to report, if you read the '65 build thread you know we took the bench seat out of the uni and installed the bench seat out of the '65 in it, without going through all the reasons we did that I'll just say the '65 seat sits better in the uni, it is lower since it hasen't been rebuilt / recovered, I'm going to drive it like this for a few weeks then make a decision on the direction we will go, either rebuild this seat or replace it with something else. We also at the same time removed the factory style mirrors to put on the '65 and replaced them with "peek" style mirrors, I'm still trying to get use to the smaller mirrors but do like the look of them on the truck.

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I read Aprils post about having $17k in her truck, given the amount of work she has done, the level of quality, the attention to detail, and the fact she is totally rebuilding her truck from the ground up not cutting any corners replacing everything including the wiring, that investment seems about right or fair to me, there is nothing cheap about doing a total restoration of a vehicle even if you do all the work yourself as she has done....and I have nothing but applause for her efforts.

But..... It got me thinking about a car we had in our shop this week, the amount of money the customer has invested in it and the trouble they are about to face from owning this vehicle and all of the future problems they are likely to encounter from having this car in their possession.

So I'll tell you the story.....

Customer comes in Tuesday with a 2014 Cadillac CTS-V that they recently purchased, it has about 43k on the clock, the complaint is that it has valve train noise at idle that may or may not go away with a load on the engine (in gear) or a higher RPM, they are the 2nd owner of this vehicle, and had the oil changed recently hoping that would solve the motor noise....nope.

So some back story about these cars.... http://www.motortrend.com/cars/cadillac/cts-v/2014/

If you followed the link and read a little you would have learned this is a "performance" Caddy, it has a 6.2L (GM LS variant) that is supercharged (yep), it makes a advertised horse power of 556, yeah you read that right 556hp, beautiful car if you like this type of vehicle, the kicker is they paid over $40k for this car and while it looks nice I suspect it has been rode hard and put up wet more than once in its life.

So we take a look at it and it actually has two noises, one is pretty obvious in the valve train and sounds deep in the motor like a cam lobe or lifter (this engine has roller lifters), the noise really doesn't get louder or go away with a increase in RPM or having a load on the engine, driving it is noticeable as a faint ticking until you open the hood. LS engines have had a few know valve train issues on high mileage engines that were not serviced regularly and ran pretty hard but mostly that is in the 5.3L versions.

But it's the other noise that is also faint but noticeable coming from the supercharger, using a stethoscope you can hear two very distinct sounds one in the lifter valley the other at the back of the supercharger. Doing a little research we find a recall for the supercharger issue, and recommend the customer to contact the dealer to see if it's still covered under the recall.

Luckily for the customer the dealer says yes it is still covered and in fact still has some of the original factory warranty on the car which they told the customer was 10 years or 80k, so Monday the dealer is sending a flatbed to pick up the car from our shop.

The issue here for me and how it relates to Aprils build and the money she has spent is like this, these folks bought a 4 year old car with less than 50k on the clock but paid over $40k for it, yes the car originally had a MSRP of around $70k+, it to me isn't a practical car to own as it's engine is kind of "exotic" being supercharged and making all that horsepower, as it gets older it is going to cost more and more to repair and the cost of those repairs is going to skyrocket, case in point if the supercharger wasn't covered under the recall their bill to just replace it could be as high as $8k which is almost half of Aprils investment in her truck, and we haven't solved the valve train noise yet. The valve train issue is likely going to be a bad lifter which in the worse case would require a new cam and lifter kit, it will also require removing the cylinder heads to replace the lifter which might require removing the engine to accomplish that task. A very safe estimate to do that work without removing the engine would probably be in the $4k area.... so we are at the least in about $12k to get rid of two potentially fatal engine noises.

That $17k April has spent is looking better and better to me, granted anything can happen in the future but given the fact that April has done everything herself and therefore knows the truck inside and out, there is a very high probability that if something happens she will know exactly where to look and be able to fix it herself.

My point is again which is a better investment of your income? a $70k car or putting $20k in a truck making it brand new again?

For our customer I'm happy the dealer is going to take care of the supercharger issue, but the valve train problem we will have to wait and see if the original factory warranty will cover that, if not the customer could still be out thousands of dollars even if the dealer co-ops on the parts and labor.

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Have a great weekend

Jon


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PostPosted: February 24, 2018, 6:40 am 
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Jon you are right. I read a lot of car reviews recently due to counseling young Coasties on how to find a good hooptie till they can afford a nice car. The cady you refer to was probably owned by someone who failed to maintain it mechanically. I see a few shipmates trade in cars that need 1k in suspension or engine repairs because they think it is cheaper to get a new car. :roll: (Then again, I’m looking at buying a home cause I don’t want to pay deposits of 1st,last and deposit on another rental- 200k on a mortgage or 4K in rent deposits....). Anyway I digress.

I have included the purchase of the air compressor, some tools, sandpaper, nuts and bolts, misc supplies and I think I added transportation of vehicle in my estimate of 17k.

Off the bat between LMC, Summit Racing, I paid about 700 in parts. At Dennis-Carpenter I paid about 3.5k in parts and National Parts Depot was another 3k. I bought the flareside bed in TN, but I needed to drive 12 hours there, rent a trailer and drive 12 hours back. I sold the wrong bed so I came out even on that portion. I paid 1k for the truck in 2012. If I were to do another vehicle, I doubt my estimate would be like that because I’m set up with tools.

You are right though, building this truck how I want it, as I have is better than paying for an unknown condition vehicle with mechanical issues about to pop their ugly heads out. Especially when they paid so much for it to be a used car.

I encourage my junior coasties to purchase a certified used if they want a newer vehicle. Because they have warranties. I did the math with them to explain why. Advise I wish I was given when I was their age.

The local ford dealer is sending me post cards, emails and phone calls requesting I bring my 2013F150FX4 crew cab 4x4 (45k miles) in for a new 2018 model. No way. I am very satisfied with my truck and have stated my intentions to let it live with me till it’s death.

I follow a FB group for that ecoboost F150 and a lot of guys complain that at 100k miles, they have timing chain rattle requiring thousands of dollars in mechanical repairs. No way dumbdumb! Who woulda guessed it would do that. (Being sarcastic).
My point is, people today are willing to pay a ton of money for a vehicle, expect it to be perfect 100% of the time and complain when regular maintenance is required, which in turns convinces them to cycle and spend more money on a new vehicle Andy start cycle all over. I read these guys are severely upside down on vehicle payments because they have neg equity when they trade in and buy newer, Saw their car payment of 800-1000 a month for 84 months. That’s insane.

Anyway, you make some great points on paying only 17k for a nicely built vehicle vice 40+k on a used unknown condition just for the status symbol.

_________________
The months may change, but I am always APRIL
'63 F100 Custom Cab 223inline 6, 3speed manual- mostly stock
https://www.youtube.com/coastiereid
Truck has been home in CA,OR,WA,NJ,VA since it's birth in San Jose Jan63


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