So here we are again....lol

So some of you may have followed our other two threads of the '62 Unibody on a 1998 Crown Vic P71 police car and the '65 SWB style side truck on a 1996 Buick Roadmaster, if you've been following those builds you would know we acquired a '62 cab, dog house, and step side bed along the way for the '65 build. We basically bought those parts for the windshield and some hood trim to use on the '65 but along the way thought about building a 3rd truck.










I guess one of the deciding factors in building the truck was that it had a title and VIN tag that matched which is a big plus in our state to get a vehicle registered and the title transferred, our state no longer will title a vehicle based on a "bill of sale" no matter how many police checks prove it isn't stolen. So having a valid title is very important, some time I'll tell you folks what we had to go through to get a title for the '65 but that's a story for another day. lol

Once we decided that it would get built, not necessarily how it would get built but that we would commit to building a 3rd truck we of course would need another donor vehicle...

I'm right in the middle of the '65 build and still can't give a definite this donor over that donor preference, it's like I have said before both the Ford and the Buick (GM) have pluses and minuses, neither in my mind is really better than the other because for one minus there is a plus to counteract the minus, both vehicles have this scenario which gives neither a clear advantage over the other. So also as I've said before it comes down for me to two things, one being I like and know GM vehicles, I like the fact that the Buick has that small block Chevy motor in it, the other deciding factor for me is the market and what you can find for the price you want to spend.... this is a constantly moving target not so much the amount your willing to spend but the choice of what you will spend it on.

With that in mind we watch Craigs list and the Facebook marketplace weekly to see what is being sold, some people want stupid money for their vehicles, case in point last week there was a '95 Impala that was being sold as a parts car, did run and drive but had a lot of miles on it (way upwards of 100k, closer to 200k) and the guy wanted $1700 for the entire car, in my opinion that was about a $1000 dollar car on a good day, but he based his price on he intended to make a Impala SS clone out of it so it's worth more money....yeah right.

The one shinning gem was on CL in the auto parts category, it was a 2k9 CV P71 that has wrecked in the right rear quarter, the ad stated it had less than 90k on the clock, so we contacted the guy on Wed and he is of course on the defense from being trolled selling stuff on CL (way too many scammers), so anyway we told him we would contact him on Saturday to go look at it if it was still available.

Saturday comes and we contact him, he's more polite this go-round and we get directions to where the car is about 20 miles away in Kentucky (across the Ohio river from us) and we pack up the dog and head that way (yeah I'll tell you about the dog sometime also...lol) We get there and they (him and his buddy) have the car running, when I get out of the truck it looks pretty bad, the right rear quarter is pushed over to the driver's side enough to bust the rear glass and wrinkle the left rear quarter panel. I pull the bumper cover back and look it was hit high above the frame and if it moved the left rear frame rail any it wouldn't matter since we will be cutting almost two feet off the rear frame rails. The frame actually looks ok and since it was behind the rear tire it shouldn't have hurt the rear end or rear suspension although the guy said the car did a couple 360s after it was hit. (his son was driving it)

The body damage doesn't bother me and they find that odd lol, they know the car isn't repairable it's too old and not worth the effort to back half the body (it's a CV there are millions of them out there), so it's a parts car or a donor, they recognize this so the amount of BS is very limited.

Motor sounds really good, it does lot drive and the transmission seems fine (it had a transmission put in it 3 days before getting hit) they have the complete history of the vehicle printed out (CarFax) along with receipts for the transmission, tune up, and service that was done right before the crash. The interior is nice the only discrepancy is that it has 102k on it not 90k, not a deal breaker for what it is and what they are asking.

So I hand them over to my wife to negotiate the price...lol, I love doing that, work the people while she sits back, then change tactics on them so they have to deal with her, when I tell people that they have to deal with her and walk away they are really confused...lol anyway she works out the money aspect and delivery (they have a roll back), they load the car on the roll back and they follow us home.

It's at this point I'll tell you folks that she packs a 9mm and has a CC permit, we both are avid 2nd amendment supporters and are well use to firing a gun since we spend time at the range improving our proficiency, we always carry a firearm when carrying cash and are very aware of our surroundings and the people we are dealing with....call it "situational awareness" my point in telling you folks this is that it's 2018 and the world has changed, you really can't trust people based solely on your gut anymore and if we had detected the least bad vibe from these guys we would have had the car picked up or just walked away from the deal, but in the end they were just "good 'ol boys from Kentucky", and they were truly impressed with the '62 uni, but I didn't take them in the shop, no need for them to see the '65, not like we are going to be friends or anything like that....lol

So here's the donor.....













So.....we bought the '09 CV P71 based solely on the timing and price, it was the right vehicle at basically the right time and that means you folks will have to endure yet another CV swap thread here on the forum, this one will be somewhat different and how that will be or turn out is yet to be decided but it's going on a CV chassis.

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Note: this thread will just sit here until the '65 is on the road, but I wanted to give the step side its own thread so when I'm ready it is ready also, I really didn't want to pollute the other threads with this info because eventually it would have to have its own thread anyway.

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Jon

Jon - that thing got whacked pretty good. I wouldn't be surprised if the rear frame rails are slightly swung left. But, as you mentioned you'll be cutting off a couple feet, so it shouldn't be a problem. You could always cross measure the rear section of frame just to make sure they're square. You should be able to find frame specs on line somewhere. Try Googling. You could also go to a body or frame shop and sweet talk them into making a copy of the specs for you. Most have them on the software that comes with their frame machine. They might charge a little. Five or ten bucks wouldn't be out of line - they do have to pay for their annual software updates not to mention the mega bucks they paid for the frame equipt in the first place. The frame specs will give you the measuring points on the frame as well as the measurement between points. The shops hang targets from those points and have a laser measuring device that gives the dimensions to the targets, but you should be able to do the same with a tape measure and a second person to hold the tape.
Looking forward to seeing what you do with this project.

Tim,

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Tim,

Tim, it wouldn't surprise me at all if they were tweaked to the left, I guess I should tell you that over the years we have built (rebuilt) a lot of totals, in fact almost every car I've ever owned up to about 10 years ago had a salvage title, it use to be the cheap way to get a nice vehicle but like everything that has changed, the salvage pool at the auto auction is plagued by people who have no idea what they are buying or salvage yards bidding the prices up so high that it really isn't any cheaper to build a total, then you have the stigma of a salvage title and the related CarFax showing the vehicle was totaled which kills the value to resale.

But I'm no stranger to fixing wrecks, and know that the CV is good enough for our usage, I have relatives that own a body shop and if it had to be straightened they would do it as a favor or very cheaply, you know how that goes it takes longer to set it up on the frame rack do the measurements then the actual pull to bring it back straight. It tracked fine viewing it from the rear so I'm confident it will be ok, but we'll measure it once the body is off....that's a ways down the road yet.

The frame rails on the CV get narrower or smaller the closer you get to the rear bumper to help absorb a rear end collision so pushing them one direction or another is pretty easy from the side, the Roadmaster isn't much different as you'll see when you get the body off yours although the wagon may be a little stiffer but I doubt it's much different from the sedan we used under the '65.

It's going to be awhile before we get to it, today it is in front of the shop covered with a tarp to keep the snow and rain out till we are ready.

Jon

Boy you're not kidding about the rebuilder market. At one time around here, you had to have a dealers license just to be able to get into the Insurance auto auctions. Some still require it, but there are those that don't, and because of that, like you said, there are people in there buying up everything in sight and then hacking them back together. That has driven up the cost of repairables. Plus, we've had an awful lot of hail events around here that has damaged a lot of body parts.
I don't know if I mentioned it, but I was a State Farm auto damage adjuster for 24 years (Just retired in 2016) so I've had plenty of opportunity to see what goes on in some of those yards. Unfortunately I've had to be the bearer of bad news to the poor folks who have purchased those poorly repaired cars, when I've had to point out the improper and in many cases unsafe repairs that were done prior to the current/new damage.
Sorry for the rant. Sounds like you have everything under control on this one - can't wait to see how it goes !!

Tim

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Tim,

Tim,

Last rebuild we did here at work was a '09 Saturn Vue for my brothers wife, that was about 4 years ago, we use to always have something here that we were building as filler work but in the last few years as that market changed we switched to doing a few restorations, not necessarily full restorations but sheet metal work or mechanical, we have done a few complete restorations but just like everyone else it's a labor intense process that is slow going and you windup with a lot of free or giveaway hours that really are not billable.

In our market you need a dealer license to buy at the auto auction, but in Indiana it's not that difficult to get a used car dealer license (we have one) you just need a paved lot, a sign, and your basically doing deals/paperwork on trunk lids, because of this cars go so much higher at auction, of course since the average cost has risen so high the some total of the used parts value is worth a lot more than it has ever been worth so salvage yards are there driving the price even higher on some vehicles like trucks.

That's cool you were adjuster, a really thankless job where you are pulled in two or three directions at the same time (customer - insurance company - repair shop), hail damaged cars.... one of my favorite vehicles to buy because we don't care about appearance (the wife and I) but it is a very good opportunity to get a mechanically fit vehicle that has cosmetic damage cheap and run the wheels off of it! lol

I also think that companies like Copart have helped raise the bar (price-wise) on buying salvage vehicles they are so large that the locals (Wolfs Auto Auction) are left with high millage trade-ins from new car dealers, fleet, impound, and tow-away vehicles to sell locally....most insurance totals around here go to Copart and get shipped up to Indianapolis for auction.

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The '09 CV we bought was a buy back from the insurance company if you look at the pictures it still had the temporary tag, the people never had enough time to even get the title transferred after they bought it before it got hit, they bought it with a bad transmission, had that rebuilt and the engine serviced, gave it to their son and 3 days later a drunk ran a red light and hit them, that was last August and it has sat while the insurance company fought it out with the guy and his insurance company over the collision. The funny thing is that I wonder if after the collision the drunk had a moment of clarity and thought I just hit a cop car...I'm f*#^@*! lol

Take care,

Jon

Found it! I don't know how I missed this thread...I will be following also. You do great work Jon. I enjoy reading your threads...very informative!

....and I wouldn't want to have to negotiate with your wife either! I chuckled out loud when I read the part about your 'handing them off to your wife" to negotiate the price...I had to read that to my wife....she laughed too...

This looks to be a great build...I'll be waiting and watching....

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1964 F-100

Steve, it's a great tactic to use in these type of deals, the wife and I are always on the same page, she will pacify them with the dog while I look over the mechanical aspect of the car, in this case there were two guys so we would either split them (she take one and I take the other) or she would just stay back out of the conversation, look pretty, and hold on to the dog while I look and listen to the seller and ask my questions (she basically just plays dumb), the later is how we worked this time she just hung back..... but after I was satisfied I looked at the seller and said "it looks fine to me, but you need to deal with her on the money part of the deal" I then turned away and walked to the other side of the car to continue looking. They were really confused which is the reaction we were looking for, kinda' take them off their guard so to speak, and then there is the aspect of two guys negotiating with a pretty petite woman holding a dog, at that point we hold most all of the cards in the negotiation...lol It's not that we were trying to beat them down on the price but the price is/was a moving target, we had a set amount we were willing to spend and in the end she got the car and delivery for that price.

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One thing totally unrelated to your post that I keep forgetting to mention about doing chassis swaps that I'm going to stick in here.....

Between the two donor vehicles we have used of course the Roadmaster is a consumer car and both of these CV P71s are considered fleet cars that are purpose built by Ford to be used as police cars or in some cases taxis, the really interesting thing about the differences between the two classes of cars (consumer and fleet) comes into play in the electrical, specifically the charging systems on both of these vehicles. The RM being a consumer car has a 140 amp alternator, both of these CV P71s has a 200 amp alternator, the newer '09 has a clutch mechanism on the alternator pulley that at idle lets the alternator only output around 140 amp but above idle goes full bore to 200 amp.

This has a positive effect on battery life, especially this time of year where your running headlight and the blower motor on high speed for a lot of your driving time in the winter, throw in any other accessory you might use that is pulling off the alternator and the parasitic draw from everything else like the computer system, fuel delivery system and the smaller alternator on the RM will be able to run everything but little will be left to put back into the battery keeping it fully charged. The CV P71 doesn't have that problem at idle putting out 140 amp it is matching the RM's greatest output above idle it's doing everything and keeping the battery fully charged with reserve amps that can be used if needed.

The charging system is another plus to using a CV P71 that I keep forgetting to mention, in the '62 uni I can run the headlights and blower on high for all the time I'm driving, nothing dims the lights like turning the blower motor off / on creating a high amperage load, the battery always is fully charged, it can sit for over a week and starts just like you just shut it off.... it doesn't have a new battery in it either in fact it's probably 3 years old.

Anyway I just wanted to point that out....

Jon

That's very interesting info. I had no idea that the P71 had that feature. I wonder if the caprice cop cars have that as well. That would sure be a nice upgrade on the plow truck. Cycling the plow pump really puts a draw on the alternator.

Tim,

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Tim,

Tim,

I would think the Caprice cop cars would be similar, if I had to guess there is probably a base spec for police cars that every manufacturer has to try to hit and exceed to make their offering more desirable than the competition.

The other thing I failed to mention is that both of these systems use a internal voltage regulator built in the alternator and while the Buick system is "free wheeling" (it produces power based on the need right up to it's rated capacity)( the voltage regulator has the entire job of managing the alternator output), the CV P71 has oversight from the ECM which can change the output in some cases increasing the output to maximum (200a) or limiting the output to it's base, this is kinda' important in a cop car that might sit and idle for hours, at some point the battery is going to be fully charged and if you continued to put back a high amperage charge into that fully charged battery it's going to cook the electrolytes out of it killing it's life.

It's kinda' interesting that the CarFax for the '09 we bought shows it has had quite a few batteries replaced in it's life, the first was at less than 30k on the clock, it was originally a cop car in a small Pennsylvania town of about 6000 people and I guess all of it's service was done at a Ford dealership so it shows up on the CarFax report, at one point it had the ECM reflashed to correct a charging system issue then the battery replacement stopped. lol

Jon

Observations....

I keep looking at that '62 step side cab and the '09 CV sitting outside trying to formulate a plan while I'm doing other things on the '65 build, I'm seriously thinking about using the CV floor and part of the firewall in that build, I think it'll be the only way to save that cab since the floor is so bad, in theory doing that would give around 6-8" more leg room for the driver because the cab steps inside would be removed and the CV floor mated to the door sills/thresholds.

One of our members (Tim / snoracer) sent me this picture that shows what I'd guess is the minimum that has to be cut out of the slicks firewall and floor to use the donor floor and firewall, it looks very doable but I'm unsure about the cab step area, the issue here is about ride height or stance without doing suspension mods....if I use the slicks floor like we did in the uni the cab will basically sit right down on the CV frame setting the ride height about the same as the uni, I'm just unsure if using the CV floor and firewall will make it sit higher or lower, there will be a limit as to just how far or low the cab can sit and match up with the CV floor.... we'll see.



I guess until we can get it in the shop and I can do some measuring I'll just have to keep guessing as to how much filler work will have to be done to mate it all together. I would still use the slicks dash so at some point I'd have to make a decision on the CV HVAC, if I reused it then some sort of fabrication would have to be done to extend the dash to cover the box, I have a couple ideas on that but again need to do some measuring. In some ways it just makes sense if you reuse the CV firewall to keep the HVAC and make it work in the slick but there will be lots of hurdles to jump hooking up the defroster and dash air vents.... I'm still on the fence, but considering it.

Like I've said before it is going to be a different type of build if for no other reason than what I have to work with, I have a few other not necessarily reservations about the build but at this point I have more questions than answers and it's just going to take getting the CV in the shop and the body off it and the slicks cab floor and firewall cut out hanging in the air to really get a idea of what I can and can't do, or just how much fabrication is going to be involved.

Still a long way down the road till we get to that project but I do spend a lot of free time thinking about it before the project starts, doing this helps me formulate a plan or at least have a idea of the direction we will take.

Jon

Here's a few more pictures that Tim / snoracer sent me, these are from Drew Bros Customs out in Arizona which SteveCanup will recognize as the people who built the '61 uni on a Roadmaster chassis in the "classic truck" magazine article he sent me a few months ago when we decided to go that route for the '65. Tim told me he had contacted Drew Brothers because of the very same magazine article and they were nice enough to answer his questions and send him these pictures of slicks in various stages of prep to sit on a donor chassis, it would appear that the '61 uni from the article wasn't the only truck they have done....

Many thanks to Tim for sharing these pictures with me, it really helped a lot in figuring a potential path for this '62 step side build, and showed more information than I could have possibility figured out on my own without a lot of wasted time.. Enjoy!










Jon

'62 Flare Side (part 1) evaluation.....

The cab from the '62 flare side is rough, maybe that is a understatement, maybe I'm just being critical, but the best words I can come up with is very rough!

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Saturday we had our friend Ryan come down and lift up the bed and cab and place them on our dollys, they needed to dry out from the winter weather so they could be evaluated, as I said above the cab is rough especially the floor, it almost looks like it has sat at one time directly on the ground with water all around it, the reality is it has a few holes in the roof that let water get inside the cab because it was uncovered.

The holes in the roof isn't that big of a deal, but of course will have to be dealt with in the rehab process.






Surprisingly the lower A pillars isn't that bad, which I find weird, in some ways they are no worse than the '65 was....certainly better than the '62 uni was.




The B pillars do have issues.....




Not sure what is up with those places, looks like a perfectly round hole, anyone have a idea?

The cab corners are of course bad.....




But it's when you go inside that you really start scratching your head at some of the things that have been done, the dash has holes, not rusted through holes, but holes drilled in a lot of different places, the radio opening has been cut out for a double DIN size radio, it does have the glove box liner that seems to be in decent shape.






The doors....both of the wing window pivots at the bottom are either broke or rotted off, not a real big deal since a new stud can be welded to the frame.




The interior of the doors is about what you'd expect given the state of the rest of it.



And the passenger door has a nice crease in a bad location...




But it's when you get to the floor that the worst is revealed....














The question isn't can it be fixed because we all know it can, the question really is "is it worth fixing", I've already stated that I refuse to put a complete new floor pan in the truck, it's way too much money and putting it on a CV chassis we would end up cutting up a expensive new floor ($1300 plus freight).

So the idea of using the Crown Vic firewall and floor is a option, and in my opinion the only option that makes any sense if we are going to use this cab, if you look at the pictures Tim sent me (posts above) you can see that most of the bad floor would be removed and replaced with the CV firewall and floor, doing that doesn't solve any of the other issues but does solve the floor, I would still need new cab steps and risers but I would probably be replacing them anyway if the cab floor was in better shape and usable.

The plus side of using the CV floor and firewall is leg room, it increases the leg room by probably 6" at the minimum, it will of course simplify hanging the brake, steering, throttle, you would have the option of reusing the CV HVAC, maybe even the steering column , it if nothing else opens up some options that I wouldn't have.

The cab has no front mounts (rotted away) but I'd have to cut them out anyway for the CV frame, the rest of the cab while rough doesn't bother me that much, given all the things I've done on the other two trucks this one is just another hill to climb that has a attainable summit. (you just need to put your head down and one foot in front of the other climbing up)

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I'd like to hear you folks opinions, keep in mind what we build, and that we are not scared of hard work, like I've stated before this is going to be a build with no time line or schedule, it is going to be a very limited budget, we will be repurposing everything that we can to keep the cost as low as possible, I have in the back of my mind not spending over $3k-$4k total on this truck, it will at the most get another rattle can paint job, and will have some new parts we will have to buy, I know it will have it's challenges....

Next time we'll look at the flare side bed.

Jon

The hole in the cab corner was probably a big antenna, fleet type radio before CB. I like the idea of using the CV floor.



Johnny

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If restoring a ford was easy, chevy guys could do it.

Johnny,

I kinda' agree but on the passenger side it looks like the same size hole that was filled with bondo so it would have had two, and the hole doesn't go all the way through the cab which I find odd, but that kinda goes with the hole in the cab roof like it had a revolving light on the roof at one time, that would explain a lot of the extra holes in the dash also.

The CV floor....yeah, it's the only way, lots of cutting and hacking to make it work, then lots of filler panels from what I've seen others do to bridge the gaps, still doable and it would save the cab from going to scrap which is where it was destine to windup.

Jon

'62 Flare Side (Evaluation part 2)

So with the cab out of the way for the moment let's look at the flare side bed which to me is the crown jewel of this build, for its age it is really in decent shape, that's again not to say it doesn't have some issues but compared to the cab the issues the bed has are minimal.

The first thing is that sometime in its life someone welded a sheet of steel to the bed floor, they did a decent job and it isn't in bad shape but it'll have to be mostly or all cut out for our purposes, I think initially we will just cut the floor to clear the CV suspension and try to retain as much of the floor as possible, that will let the bed as a whole keep most of its structural integrity and hopefully it will stay square throughout the process.

Looking at the underside of the bed it looks like only a couple of the original mounts/braces are still intact the very front brace was in the bed and is good enough that it could be reused but at least one other is missing, not a big deal since it would fall in the area between the wheel tubs that has to be cut out for the CV suspension.



The exterior of the bed isn't that bad, it has a very minimal amount of rot, nothing really rusted through except the area where the steps and fenders connect, not a big deal at all in my opinion.






It has a good working tail gate, the fenders are not too bad, the passenger fender is pulled out in the top of the wheel opening from someone lifting it in that area but should go right back in place with a little persuasion, it has lights, and I may reuse them after removing them, straightening the mounting brackets, and looking to see if they are still usable.



All in all it's a very usable piece with mostly cosmetic damage, it is certainly the best piece of all the sheet metal in my opinion.

The dog house has been disassembled for months but here is what it looks like....



It's again a decent piece with limited issues, the core support does have some rot but no worse than the support from the '65 that I repaired and modified. I do not have any inner fenders for this front end but do have the steel inner fenders from the Roadmaster and will have the plastic inner fenders from the CV donor.

None of these parts bother me, the cab is the issue, could look for another cab but that is also expensive especially if the cab has a good title which the one we have does have..

The hood while basically a good piece does have this issue that would have to be repaired...




Again not a real big deal because of what we are building.....

I do know I won't be using the CV trunk floor this time like I did in the uni, this time the fuel tank will come out and mounts fabricated for the fuel tank, I've now seen a couple different builds doing that and it makes a much nicer-cleaner look, it doesn't change the tank location but does remove the CV trunk floor from the equation.

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Monday I went out and aired the tires up on the '09 CV donor, and after sitting for a month it fired right up, that was a good test of the battery, and it shows there isn't any odd parasitic drain happening that I'd need to look for so I' convinced it's basically good to go, I do wish I could drive it for a week or so but because of the body damage that isn't a possibility so we will just have to cross our fingers that there is nothing unforeseen.

Jon

Definitely following this one!!

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TJ


If some is good, more is better, and too much is just right! ~ Shayf

Thanks TJ,

Actually we did a little work on the '62 cab this weekend which I'll post this week.

Jon

'62 Flare side tear down (part 1)

Prologue:

We have decided to use the cab we have for the next build, both of us know it is going to take a lot of effort to bring the cab back to a usable piece, it has lots of issues that go beyond the cab floor that will get cut out. There will be lots of patches that will require welding and filler to be used like the holes in the cab roof, not to mention the dash and all of the holes that have been drilled into it over the years.

But.... this will yet again be a Rusto-Mod type of build so imperfect body work will not be a major issue, there is a lot that has to be done that is above and beyond just making the cab accept the donor firewall and floor, so in a lot of ways it might just be the best idea to use this cab even with all of its flaws and issues. If we did try to find another cab it would be expensive if in better shape, and in the end we would be cutting it in the same manner as this POS cab which I would hate to do, a better cab should find its way onto a restoration or a lot nicer truck build than what we do. I have the confidence that we can make the cab work and fix its issues but is going to take a considerable amount of time and effort.

Once again we are a lot less concern with how the exterior will wind up looking as we are the interior, if you followed the '65 build thread you know that the interior of that truck looks really nice, this will be the same in a lot of ways because it's been our philosophy through each build to make the mechanical and interior nice but a lot less attention to the exterior appearance, the '65 looks nice in pictures or at 10' or so in person but that will change to look more like the '62 uni before the truck is truly finished, I know that goes against a lot of conventional thought on building a vehicle, but it is again our desire to not have a pretty, shiny, perfect exterior... it's just our preference. So this truck will get painted similar to the '65 (rattle can) but will not stay that way for long.

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So with the evaluation done and a path or plan decided on I had some time on Monday to start stripping the cab, I had previously stripped out the driver's door of the glass, window regulator, and wing window assembly, so it was time to get that door off the cab, this time I drilled two reference holes per hinge instead of one hoping that on reassembly that will give me a better chance at lining up the door.



Pro Tip: If you have a lot of rot in the lower hinge pocket / A pillar area when you go to remove the lower hinge bolts that are inside the hinge pocket get both of them broken loose before removing either bolt, both of these bolts thread into a encapsulated steel plate that there is a real good chance the metal is rotten that holds the plate, if you just remove one of the bolts the plate will spin around and you'll have to find a way to wedge the plate to get the other bolt out, if you break both loose first then it's easy to get them out but don't be surprised if after removing the bolts the plate falls out on the ground, or into the bottom of the A pillar. lol

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With the door off I moved on to removing the pedal assembly (yeah, someone cut the clutch pedal off...what a waste), wiring harness, and heater box.

Speaking of the heater box, this yet again a different combination than either the '62 uni or the '65, this heater box while looks like the uni's heater box but had a set of knobs mounted under the dash in the center of the dash, one knob went to a water control valve out in the engine bay (water shut off) and the other went to a door on the heater box (blend door?), the dash control still had the push/pull knob for the floor/defroster and blower speeds...I'm not real sure what the other cable from the knob under the dash does... any ideas?

Like the '62 uni it doesn't have the fresh air intake in the A pillar cavity like the '65 has....., could this have been a "custom cab" when it was made? and do custom cabs have different heater boxes or added controls that the standard cab didn't have? I know we kinda' talked about this in Aprils Shipwrecked thread but this is yet again another variation, I just find it odd that Ford would make so many different combinations when they were known for more standardization of parts between the vehicles they produced back in the '60s.







I don't know if you can see in this picture but just in this small area there are 5 holes of which only two are suppose to be there.



This dash is going to be fun just welding up the holes people have punched or drilled over the years...lol

With the dash stripped I went over and removed all the stuff from the passenger door, drilled the reference holes in the hinges and removed that door.



So most everything is stripped out of the cab, the next item will be removing the windshield and rear glass, I have my doubts if the windshield will come out without breaking, the rubber gasket is rock hard and it has the stainless trim, if it breaks it'll just have to be, it has a lot of white discoloration (de-lamination) at the bottom of the glass by the cowl that is only going to get worse over time sitting in the sun so it really needs to be replaced anyway.

Once the glass is out I'll have to decide how I want to brace the inside of the cab with 1x1 square tube, since the firewall and floor has to be cut out I want to brace the A pillars and door openings before I start cutting so everything stays basically in alignment.

Like I've said before this is uncharted territory for me so I want to think it through and have a plan before I start cutting, last thing I want to happen is that everything moves and the doors don't fit with no possibility of adjusting them far enough to make it all work. I do plan to cut the firewall right below the cowl, under that seam where the top of the firewall meets the cowl so it stays intact, then leave the cab steps but cut the risers and the floor back to about where the seat bolts down , so that would remove all of the firewall, toe boards, floor pans (foot wells) and trans hump, then at that point I can see what else has to go to mate the two together.

I'm pretty sure the rear mount area of the cab will have to go, at least the floor portion, I'm not sure about the mount/brace in the rear of the cab until I get to that point, I know that in using the donor firewall and floor that the donor front mounts will be reused but I'm unsure of the rear, we'll just have to cross that bridge when we come to it.

Here's a few random pictures....








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With the end of the '65 build sneaking up on me a lot quicker than I thought it would I need to start thinking more about this flare side build and how we will get it accomplished, I do know that once the body is off the '09 donor I'll have to move pretty quick to get the cab on it at least sitting there, I don't want the donor chassis sitting outside unprotected and I don't want to tie up all the shop space for very long so my wife has to put off her customers waiting on me. Once the cab is sitting on the donor I'll have as much time as we need.

Jon

Update: #1

I haven't had time to do much more on the '62 flare side truck, I did spray down the fender bolts hoping that they will come loose, if not the plasma cutter will take care of them, while doing that I took a good look at the underside of the bed to see what bracing was left, most of the bracing that runs from side to side is still intact, of course in the areas where the bed has to be cut away, but the front brace/mounting isn't attached but I do have it, I just need to decide if I'll cut the entire floor out or just the amount for the CV suspension to pass through. I'll probably just cut what is necessary although I haven't totally decided yet..... I got lots of time to figure that part out.

Unlike the uni I won't be using the CV trunk floor this time for several reasons, it's easy enough to make a angle iron mount for the fuel tank which takes that unsightly truck floor out of the mix, and I won't have to fabricate any mount to support the bottom of that trunk floor/fuel tank like I did in the uni....it's not really less work but will look better on the completed truck.

For those of you that are interested in this type of chassis swap using the donor floor and firewall here's a video that shows you what you might be in store for, it's a good visual representation of what has to be done to put a square peg (CV firewall) in a round hole (slick cowl)...lol



There's really nothing about this type of chassis swap that looks easy as compared to the two I've done before, there also isn't a clear and defined path to follow, you kind of make it up along the way doing whatever you need to do to fit your application. Of the couple swaps using the donor firewall and floor I've seen pictures or video of there were similarities between them because you are doing the same process but the way or path each person took was different in a lot of ways. I guess that could be a good thing or a bad thing depending on your point of view and what you want the end goal of your build to be.

A case in point, if you watch the video above in it or the next video he posted he closed up the cowl vents at the windshield I understand exactly why he did it but because he did seal up the cowl vents he could have cut the cowl out to fit the CV firewall (square CV vs Slick round corners) and maybe had less area to make filler panels for, maybe not, since I haven't done the build yet I just have observations of what others have or are doing in their builds.

I do like how he kept some of the cab step area that will allow the cab to sit lower on the donor chassis and because of how the CV floor is formed you still get a increase in leg room, you wouldn't have to do that but it is a very good idea keeping the cab step, in our build though I think we will use more of the donor floor, if I can I think we will try to use all of the donor floor including the seating area mating them either at the back of the cab or inside at the rear cab mount area where the fuel tank use to be. Where we stop will in my mind be dictated by where the closest CV body mount is in relation to where the original slick rear cab mount is, we have to support the back of the cab and either will work (original slick location or a close CV floor location) but until it's all blown apart I just don't know which we will use or how we will accomplish mounting the rear of the cab.

I guess just like the two swaps I've done there really isn't any type of right or wrong way to do them and I'm sure the '62 flare side build will be more of the same where I'll have to draw on the knowledge I've gained from the first two builds to avoid mistakes on this one but improvise along the way when we get to uncharted territory, I'm really excited to get started on it but need to keep my pace and finish the '65 before we go whole hog on the flare side.

Jon

Tear down (part 2)

On Monday I had pretty well worked myself out of a job on the '65 build, So I started back on the '62 flare side cab removing the glass.



I did get the windshield out with only one crack, we had decided that we will be replacing it so no harm, the rubber gasket was hard as a rock and came off in chunks, it was so hard you really couldn't cut it with a razor knife so I had to dig the gasket up on the inside bending it up till it broke in small chunks, once I had the bottom (dash ) and up both A pillars the windshield came free. The stainless windshield trim came off without any issue and is in good shape, we won't be reusing it so it should find a new home.

The rear glass came out the same way but by prying the gasket up from the outside lip so I was never on the glass, the windshield went right in the trash and the rear glass went into protective storage till reassembly.



The windshield had apparently been in and out a few times over its life and the last time a healthy bead of silicone rubber had been used to help the gasket seal, it took awhile with a drill and wire wheel to remove all the silicone from the pinch weld around the windshield opening.



While I was there I sanded and primed the wiper pivot holes in the cowl with their first treatment on the long road to usability.....lol

And I do still need to remove the wiper motor and transmission which I'll get to when the firewall is cut out, having it out will give me a good sample to play around with to see if I can adapt the donor wiper motor to the slicks mount and transmission.



So as far as the cab is concern I'm about at the point I need to brace the inside in preparation to cut the floor and firewall out, I plan to use 1"x1" square tubing to brace the lower A pillars and door openings to try to keep everything reasonably kinda' square and in the same location, I will be leaving about half of the cab steps which will keep the lower A and B pillars tied together, and will replace the steps/rockers with new parts after the cab is on the CV chassis. From doing the '62 uni I have a pretty good idea of how much of the cab step to cut away and have it fit over the CV frame rails while keeping it all tied together.

Like I said before in another post I'm trying to avoid a situation where the door opening change and I can't fix the problem, what I'm going to do might be over kill but I'm just trying to cover all the bases and do as much as I can to insure I don't screw up.

With the cab about as far as I can take it right now I moved over to the bed and removed the steps and fenders from each side.











With that done the bed is also ready to cut the floor to fit around the CV rear suspension and fuel tank, I need to do some measuring that I really can't do until the body comes off the CV, so I just pushed it back into the corner for now.

If I get a chance next weekend I'll get the square tubing cut and welded in to brace the cab and start cutting the firewall and floor out of it, then it will be a waiting game until we have a weekend to totally devote to pulling the body off the CV, I need to not only have the few days in a row to get it accomplished but be able to do it at a time when I can get our friend with the loader to come lift the body off like we did the Roadmaster, that will save a lot of cutting into small chunks that we can move out of the shop by hand.

But it is still going to require figuring out where to cut the CV, how much to leave, I have a decent idea of where to cut but want to be sure to leave more than what I need so making filler panels is kept at a minimum if that is even a possibility at this point I have a idea and that is about all I have. lol



I do know one thing there sure are a lot of holes that will have to be taken care of...lol













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Jon