66 F100 Power Steering

[Shawn F.]

I am in the process of adding power steering to my 66 F100. I have all the parts together, cleaned up and fitted. I am going to take it out and redo my brake lines and add power brakes to the truck because a few lines were rusted so in the process they broke. With the new p/s box being bigger, the old huge proportioning valve will not fit correctly and the lines that ARE still good do not fit.
What I am trying to ask here is does any of you have any pictures of your engine compartment with your brake setup? I am thinking of getting a smaller valve that sits next to the M/C and out of the way and run my lines in a nice coil and straight down to the frame rail and where they need to be.
I'd appreciate any information, suggestions, and/or help.
Thanks!

[cdherman]

"Huge old Proportioning valve" -- on a 66??? If it had a single chamber master cylinder then it didn't have a prop valve.

If you mean the distribution block that sits down by the steering gear, then you should know that it just takes one line from the MC and sends it three ways.

I harvested a prop valve from a 78, along with spindles etc. There are two lines into a prop valve and three out. Best place I found to mount it was on the back side of the engine cross member.

Since there was never a "stock" location in 66, you can do what makes you happy. I have seen a lot of pics with the prop valve fastened to a bracket on the power steering gear in the later trucks. But it looks better in my opinion where I put it. I suspect you would like a pic. I'll try , but no guarantee...

I would NOT mount the prop valve up high, close to the master cylinder. Remember, 2 lines in and three out. You will have even more mumbo jumbo in the engine compartment if you put the prop valve in plain sight.

Also, what you going to do for brake light switch. Please don't try to splice a "T" for the pressure activated switch. That requires more pressure to light up the brake lights, which means they light up later. Which means your chances of being rear-ended go up.

I made a bracket to attach to the steering column that worked well with the later plunger swtich. Now, as part of my current PS, autotranny swap, I have the plunger switch mounted WAY up under the dash. But I had to remove the whole brake pedal bracket to install. If you are interested in that approach say so and I'll try to post pics.....

There are a number of us who have done the brake and PS upgrade. I don' t think there is a "correct way" of doing it. But the advice is free.

Have fun.....

[douglloyd]

There are some pretty good articles on drum to disk brake swaps for '65-'66 F100's on the internet that involve replacing the old single pot master with a dual and installing a proportioning (sp?) valve in different spots. Can't remember which sites I read these on - guys?

Anyhow, cd is right about locating the plumbing on the frame - that way your lines can be run in protected areas, less chance of banging something up. From what I read, there is not a lot of adjustment needed for this valve - set it based on how much pressure you want front vs back and leave it. So a cross member would be a good location.

Someday I _might_ even do this brake upgrade myself<g> got the parts a while back, trucks just stay busy all the time.

Doug

[jwh f-100]

I plan to add a dual master soon but still on the fence on the disc swap. When I add the dual MC I think I will use this valve below then I'll be ready if I do the disc swap and I will not need to worry about a switch. It is a distribution block, prop valve, and switch all in one.



http://www.parts123.com/parts123/yb.dll ... Z50000016e

P.S. I have had good luck with these folks. They have a ton of small block parts and other items that can be used on the slicks.

[Hawkrod]

Also keep in mind that a coil of brake line is between the cab and frame to allow for movement of the cab (there is actually quite a bit when you drive, more than you would have imagined). The coil allows for the movement without causing stress fractures or work hardening of the line. If you mount the junction block on the cab you will need a coil of tubing for each line out between the junction block and frame. Hawkrod

[Jonas]

Shawn,

I have a 72 F250 with Disc Brakes. (I'm going to use to convert my 65 f250 PS and Disc Brakes). You are welcome to come over and check it out. No motor or hood so you can see everthing. You could duplicate it's line routings. It's P valve is mounted down on the frame. Just let me know. Could check out the progress on my 66 too.

FYI Shawn's truck already has disc front brakes(reason for big P valve)

[cdherman]

You are wasting effort doing just part of a conversion -- you'll likely regret it. For one, the MC is differert for Drum Drum setup, as opposed to Disk Drum. So you would later have to ditch the Drum Drum master if you decide to go to disks.

Go find a donor vehicle and get the spindles, Ibeams too if you can, propvalve as well. Grab the MC and booster if the price is right -- you can always use them for the corecharge.

That prop valve and switch in the picture is good looking, but it will light up your tail light much slower than a plunger style switch which can be located in the cab under the dash.

There are good How to articles over at www.fordification.com and http://mongrelmotorsports.homestead.com/f100discs.html

[Shawn F.]

Thanks for the help guys. Kaylle, maybe next weekend I can stop by if that is ok with you. Also, I have disks on the front from a 76 and beams, etc. I also have a dual M/C with two lines going into the valve and 3 out. I just want to figure out a cleaner way to mount all of this and make the lines and coils look clean. As for the light switch I have an electric one on the column that when you press the pedal the lever on the switch opens and makes the brake lights come on. Looks tacky but you cannot see it unless you look under the dash. Just some plain silver switch and lever made of metal. It works so I am happy. I will see about mounting the valve near the cross member like explained and help clean it up because the lines are very close to my headers which are ceramic coated MAC shorty mustang headers (only thing I found to fit). I got very lucky with the headers fitting the steering box, it is very close but works.
After I get this done I will need to get a power booster so I can have power brakes.

[ICEMAN6166]

That prop valve and switch in the picture is good looking, but it will light up your tail light much slower than a plunger style switch which can be located in the cab under the dash.l

where does that info come from ?

not trying to start a big argument here but i do not believe that.
i have both types of switch and there is no proof to back it up that i have seen. of course i doubt too the ability of the eyes to judge nano- or milliseconds especially when the observer may be yakking on the phone,texting, applying makeup or shaving while driving.

bring a stopwatch to SS and we can test this in reality with several witnesses and then publish the results here.

[jwh f-100]

You are wasting effort doing just part of a conversion -- you'll likely regret it. For one, the MC is differert for Drum Drum setup, as opposed to Disk Drum. So you would later have to ditch the Drum Drum master if you decide to go to disks.

Go find a donor vehicle and get the spindles, Ibeams too if you can, propvalve as well. Grab the MC and booster if the price is right -- you can always use them for the corecharge.

That prop valve and switch in the picture is good looking, but it will light up your tail light much slower than a plunger style switch which can be located in the cab under the dash.

There are good How to articles over at www.fordification.com and http://mongrelmotorsports.homestead.com/f100discs.html

Thanks cd you are probably right on the disc I should just do it. I wish it was as easy as getting a donor but I have a straight axle truck. IF I go to discs later IMO i think it would be much less headaches to just swap out to a MC rather than replumbing and changing valves and switches. IMO I'm with ICE on the switch, plus up here in the "sticks" most people are too slow to notice a difference.

[banjopicker66]

Iceman, I can say with authority that the pressure valve light does indeed respond slower than a pedal mounted switch.
After I was nearly re-ended by a rice burner (with good brakes), I had my wife check the brake lights.
I found that it was not a slower response as much as it was a pressure differential response. I had to apply significantly more pressure to the pedal to activate the brake lights than to activate the lights on any of my other vehicles.
I simulated a slow stop, a fast stop and a stomp-on-it-betsy-we're-gonna-die-if-you-don't kind of stop.
The light was definitely slower on the hardest stop. Not enough to measure with a stopwatch, but definitely slower. Not enough to make a difference perhaps, but noticably slower.
On the other two tests, I was actually able to apply the brakes to slow my Sweet Southern Comfort down without the lights coming on.
Then I changed the brake light switch for anew one - the old one was original, as far as I could tell. At last it was the same one she had when I bought her nearly 30 years ago.
When I changed it, the lights responded a little more quickly, but not by much.

At any rate, a pedal mounted switch turns the brake lights on as soon as the pedal is moved, rather than under pressure from brake fluid.

I might add that most folks' driving styles are drastically different than when our trucks were built. They drive to the limit of operational capability, which exceeds what our Slicks can do.

In the interest of safety, not to mention I don't want to get only $500 salvage insurance for a rust free bed getting rear ended, I will eventually install a pedal mouonted switch.

[cdherman]

dup

[cdherman]

Thanks cd you are probably right on the disc I should just do it. I wish it was as easy as getting a donor but I have a straight axle truck. IF I go to discs later IMO i think it would be much less headaches to just swap out to a MC rather than replumbing and changing valves and switches. IMO I'm with ICE on the switch, plus up here in the "sticks" most people are too slow to notice a difference.

Sorry bout that. Iwas thinking that the orginal poster had a 66 with twin Ibeam and I missed that you were not the same poster.

As to the pressure switch issue -- if the plunger switch is properly adjusted it comes on when you put your foot on the pedal, even before you squash on the brakes. This is the way modern vehicles are set up, more or less. In traffic, watch closely how the brake lights often pop on before any notable decelleration occurs. You want the driver behind you to know that you have your foot on the pedal. It tells him/her that you see something that bothers you, or the traffic is slowing ahead of you.

Drivers, expecially on fast (too fast) urban freeways, are accustomed to tailgating and assume they have a little time from first light in the brakes in the car ahead to really needing to slow. Your pressure switch is going to not give them that extra 1/2 second before you actually press harder on the brake.

On any given morning I could be rear ended on multiple occassions if I were to aggressively brake before at least putting my foot lightly on the pedal.

I actually think the pressure swtich is OK in more rural places, as the amount of overt tailgating that occurs there is much less. But in town, I really think the plunger switch is better.....

Sorry to sound like I am beating dead horse, but there is indeed a reason why the went away from the pressure switches....

[Greg D]

Jason, do the disc swap. You will LOVE how it stops afterwards! I don't even wish I went power with mine.

http://www.fordtruk.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2647

[Shawn F.]

What kind of power booster should I look for if I have disks up front and dual M/C already? Is a booster all I need as well or is there more?

[Payner44]

I recently used this MC for my manual disc set up, but this unit will work for any configuration you want and will work with a booster if desired....highly recommended.

http://www.classicperform.com/NewProduc ... 1500-C.jpg

[Shawn F.]

That is a VERY nice setup but I cannot afford it right now. I already have a dual M/C, just need a booster. If I need to redo my lines then I would rather get the booster first and put it in and then rerun new brake lines from the M/C to the prop. valve.