Houston, we have a problem

[Uncle Skip]

Bad news this week.
Most of you on here know about our Houston member Dale and his red and white 542 stroker motored '66 and all the Houston group knows him and his truck very well.
His daily driver crapped out on him and he had to drive the Slick in the rain. Now remember, this truck will spin the tires at 75mph, so on the way to work he apparently hit a patch of water going about 55, spun the tires and the truck into the concrete median barrier and crushed the drivers side front end and maybe twisted the frame.
This is all the result of a locked rear end and no weight on the back of the truck.
Folks, if you have a locker, for goodness sake, please be careful on slick (no pun intended) or rainy roadways. They will turn on you in a heartbeat.
The good news is nobody was hurt, nobody else was involved, and the truck can be fixed.
BTW, disk brake rear ends will cause this condition too. Be careful.
Here's the truck before.
I'll have pictures of the after as soon as I can get them.

[charliemccraney]

That sucks. It's good that no one was hurt.

Why will disk brake rear ends do the same?

[Toyz]

News at 6!

Paul

[Toyz]

Not near as bad as I was expecting!



Hood is somewhat tweaked, doors and cowl are unhurt except for slight paint chip on right door.
One frame horn is ripped, the other is totally collapsed. Anyone with good frame horns, let me know; I have a set, but hate to cut up a salvageable frame!
Dale has another recently anodized grille, I have an upper valance removed from Spot, radiator and fans (all three) survived. I have frame dimensions (somewhere), so I am recommending a frame shop after horn replacement; no evidence of further damage, but well worth checking.
Nitto Drag radials of that size and width just aren't the ticket for Houston's canals; simple and common case of hydroplaning. The results could very well have been the same with a six cylinder without TracLock. The rear-mounted gas tank and sway bars on this extremely thought-out and well-built truck, may have helped some, but obviously not enough.
I have experienced the same situation with very similar results; Dale is an excellent driver IMO; there just ain't much you can do in those split-seconds!
There's a reason racers switch to a softer compound under slick conditions!
Gonna be a busy weekend!
Paul

[62galxe]

That sucks. Glad Dale is ok. I can probably help with the frame horns. Ill look at my frame and see what kinda shape there in.

[Rusted64]

Oh man, that is horrible news about the accident.

Just glad Dale is ok.

Let me know if a driver door or fender is needed, I might have some good metal for the repair.

We need to get that slick back to normal. Is is one of the best I have seen.




J

[jamesdfo]

Man, it sure sucks to see pics of nice iron all bent up like that....and not the first story I've heard of troubles with a Detroit Locker......

Paul: The proper procedure would be frame rack first, and then if need be, splice on the horns.

Not much point in splicing anything onto a tweaked frame, and only adds to the degree of difficulty in trying to get it all back to square & level.........

James

Not near as bad as I was expecting!

One frame horn is ripped, the other is totally collapsed. Anyone with good frame horns, let me know; I have a set, but hate to cut up a salvageable frame!
I have frame dimensions (somewhere), so I am recommending a frame shop after horn replacement; no evidence of further damage, but well worth checking.

Paul

[Toyz]

Kenny, thanks, we are talking of straightening the passenger side. I thought I had a frame with a good driver's side; now I'm not sure how good it is. We'll know tomorrow.
Jason, thanks also, Dale has one fender, like me, he's not certain which side, so we may be calling. Hopefully, we'll know more tomorrow; got one more truck which will have to be priority, then it's BTTW. Dale's new shop will definitely help; I'm not accustomed to having room to walk, let alone stretch. Sure need Daryl's shop a/c, though .
James, I agree, but most reputable frame shops probably won't be available, oh, say, very early Sunday morning, so I have a feeling the horns'll get hung!
Those who participated in or witnessed the effort on Chris's truck last year probably have a pretty good idea how this is going to progress. I've met some of Dale's co-workers and other friends today; it doesn't appear that experience or enthusiasm will be a limiting factor!




Paul

[Toyz]

James, Dale's is a Traction Lock; I hear what you are saying, however! My Drag Pak Cobra with 4.30 Detroit Locker was a handful, especially when new!
It evidently wasn't a matter of spinning,this was simply hydro-planing. He's got super-wide and tall Nitto drag radials under tubs; while they are pretty good for dry traction, they ain't worth a sheeet on wet streets, IMO. At this point Dale is talking about just buying a good set of slicks and running a more suitable tire for most usage. He wants (and needs) more gear; however, not sure how that may play out!
Paul

[Uncle Skip]

I've got a passenger door that isn't doing anything right now.

[62galxe]

I had a bump side that hit a wall like that. It shifted the frame diagnoly and bent between the bed and cab. Didn't hurt anything as far as drivability. It did go down the road a little sideways. If you need the frame horn let me know. I'm in the medical center area daily.

[jamesdfo]

Yup, that hydroplaning is not a pleasant experience, even when you don't end up hitting something. Back in the eighties, I had a pretty clean '78 dentside lwb, with brand new Michelins on it.....driving down the correction line out south of Grande Prairie (ALBERTA, not Texas) in the middle of a heavy downpour, the front end hydroplaned, and I ended up with the truck 90 degrees to the centerline......I figured for sure it was going to hook up and go over, but miraculously it stayed on the wheels and I was able to bring it around:).....but after cleaning out my britches, I sure enough did slow down a bunch after that:) The road was horribly rutted from all the Chip Trucks that went across it every day on their way to the Pulp Mill, so the water in the ruts was probably 3" or deeper....noy exactly good conditions:)

[bmcgc]

Exactly why Im apprehensive about using a Slick as a tow vehicle for the bikes.

[jamesdfo]

I think hydroplaning has much more to do with road conditions & the type of tires ( & width) you are running than it does the year/make/model of vehicle......

James

Exactly why Im apprehensive about using a Slick as a tow vehicle for the bikes.

[bmcgc]

I think hydroplaning has much more to do with road conditions & the type of tires ( & width) you are running than it does the year/make/model of vehicle......

James

Exactly why Im apprehensive about using a Slick as a tow vehicle for the bikes.

Im talking about driving 50 year old technology and safety equipment on the interstate pulling a trailer vs 2014 technology doing the same thing.

[longcabjohn]

Don't cut frame horns, any good frame man should have that frame straight by lunch.



Johnny

[Toyz]

Driver's horn is accordioned as well as ripped and severely crunched. Passenger side will be straightened and repaired. At this point all frame damage appears to be front of sway bar mounts, so we have a good base for "fish-mouthing". "Diamonding " is always a possibility, I'll tram it probably tomorrow. Doors are undamaged down to the paint except a small chip on inner surface of skin.
Kenny, you are correct, there is misalignment between cab and bed. It's not severe, but is evident and will be corrected. The truck took more of a frontal blow than I first assumed. We will know more when I release the mounts and core support. I'm just the navigator, but we will need a driver's horn. I'll talk with Dale and get back to you.
The core support appears repairable, if not I'm in favor of hiring a bunch of metal worms to duplicate all the additional holes in that thing!
It is really a joy to work on such a clean vehicle; our clothing was dirtier than the vehicle!
Thanks everyone,
Paul

[62galxe]

I straightened my bump frame. just took a few chains, comealong and some trees in the right places. LOL What you have to worry about is diagonal misalignment. When one frame rail gets stopped like that sometimes the other side shifts forward.

[Toyz]

No doubt technology has made vehicles more controlled in adverse conditions. Hydroplaning is another matter completely, IMO. Prevention by proper loading, tire technology, correct pressures, and, yeah, appropriate speeds, trumps reactive technology , again IMO.
Dale's truck has Wilwood brakes, sway bars front and rear, a limited slip, and rear mounted gas tanks. It is about as well balanced as you can make these trucks, unless your name is Mark .The Nitto Drag Radials have always been a concern to me; they are excellent for dry traction, but very poor on wet surfaces, especially when wider than a football field
With my highly boosted, thus somewhat pipey, SVO, it can really get hairy, to the point I would probably park it before driving in wet conditions.
Paul

[Toyz]

Kenny, that is a very valid point, that is what the diamonding and tramming comments were all about. Dale is not one to shortcut anything, and probably would not let me in the shop with the big Massey or the old tow truck. The building beams don't look strong enough; so I guess we are stuck with some push/pull hydraulic body tools, some decent tramming tools, a plasma cutter, and a small smoke wrench, LOL. I have tools I fabricated years ago to pull out F-series cowls from the point of damage; there is no cowl damage on this truck.
Yeah, I know it is not a dedicated frame machine; I will do my best to recommend that approach for checkout. The driver's side wheel and tire were not even scuffed, the relatively minor body misalignment found so far gives me additional respect for the Twin-beam trucks. I certainly could straighten the existing frame rail; however, because it IS ripped and highly distorted, I think Dale's approach is correct. The passenger side is also ripped, but easily repaired, and I much prefer to leave it in place to gain some semblance of original positioning. These vehicles were not built on a CNC machine, and have seem nearly a half century of who knows what.
Ya'll realize I'm the seeming pessimist who throws the "what if's" in the mix; I'm pretty sure a visit to a quality frame and front end shop is in the plan.
Paul